Path: utzoo!attcan!ncrcan!ziebmef!ragnarok
From: ragnarok@ziebmef.uucp (Ragnarok)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.cbm
Subject: Re: A better C128 term (was Re: DesTerm gripes)
Summary: Don't waste net bandwidth with an unsolicited ad!
Keywords: Dialogue, Desterm
Message-ID: <1989May18.005309.23522@ziebmef.uucp>
Date: 18 May 89 04:53:08 GMT
References: <2346.2469060E@isishq.FIDONET.ORG>
Reply-To: ragnarok@ziebmef.UUCP (Ragnarok)
Distribution: comp
Organization: Ziebmef Public Access Unix, Toronto, Ontario
Lines: 93

In article <2346.2469060E@isishq.FIDONET.ORG>
izot@f171.n221.z1.FIDONET.ORG (Geoffrey Welsh) writes:

> > [My comments from a previous message]
> >
> > Well, our Desterm arrived DOA at this site, but from what I've been hearing
> > it's probably been for the best.
> 
>   Why, that's mighty kind of you! BTW, future UUENCODEs will not suffer from 
>the mailer-mauled space problem as I have corrected the software here.

Remember, all I've had to go on so far are users' remarks in this newsgroup;
and, to be honest, they haven't exactly been glowing recommendations (not that
I expected them to be - otherwise I would have wondered how much these users
had been paid off to endorse the product).  However, there have been a number
of complaints about Desterm, enough to justify my off-hand remark, I think.
 
> > OK, I've got (IMHO) a better terminal for you for the C128:
> > Dialogue 128, by Workable Concepts here in Toronto.
> 
>   We're aware of who the "competition" is (I've known both Jeff Goebel and 
>Gary Farmaner for a couple of years - Gary was a regular user on a BBS I ran 
>in Toronto while he was still working on Pro-Term). We'd like to offer these 
>points to consider when comparing DesTerm to Dialogue:

As I recall, I (briefly) compared Dialogue NOT with Desterm, but with BobsTerm
Pro.  I don't know why you're treating my message as some kind of put-down
that you have to redress by writing a heavily-biased product blurb.

Interesting how you immediately went on the defensive.  I didn't post with
the intention of slamming another product, as you seem to have; moreover, I
have to wonder how confident you feel about your own product if you feel it
can't stand up on its own merits without your having to point out every
feature in comparison to your "competition" (your choice of words, not mine).

The posting was done in the spirit of sharing a personal opinion with others;
your message makes it seem as if I was trying to drum up business for 
Workable Concepts.  I said it then, and I'll say it now:  I have NO connection
with Workable Concepts.  I don't even know the people you're talking about
personally; I purchased my copy from a computer store.  If you have any bones
to pick with Workable Concepts, take it up with them; don't drag me into it.
I believe we all know what IMHO means?

>   Dialogue has been on the market for over six months, DesTerm for more like 
>six weeks. We're willing to bet that we will not only catch up to, but 
>overtake, Dialogue in terms of features. Gary must be aware of this: some of 
>Dialogue's "new features" are found in DesTerm!
> 
>   Dialogue is a *commercial* product - $69.95 Canadian, I believe (correct
>me if I'm wrong). DesTerm is *shareware* - get a copy for next to nothing, 
>register for $25. I do not know what Workable Concepts is doing regarding
>U.S. sales... shareware has no problem crossing the border. I've even had a
>message arrive from Down Under.

I don't know if I made it clear in my previous message, but perhaps I didn't.
Dialogue is indeed a commercial product.  My copy cost me $59.95 CDN + PST.

The way that second paragraph in the immediately previous attribution is
written makes me think that your posting Desterm is less a generous gesture
than an attempt to encompass a larger potential market.  I'm probably wrong,
and I hope I am; I'm not sure how net administrators would see it.  Posting
with the expectation of financial return is a sure way of receiving large
phone bills, or at the very least the wrath of node administrators...

>   Dialogue support is limited to the Workable Concepts BBS (it's on 
>PunterNet, but that Net consists of less than 50 North American BBSes - most 
>of them in and around Toronto - and provides only netmail capability) and 
>Workable Concept's presence on Canada Remote Systems, a 60-line BBS in 
>Mississauga. DesTerm support includes those PLUS Usenet news, PLUS FidoNet 
>echomail - we may not be making the money that Workable Concepts is, but
>we're determined to offer superior product & services.

Your insistence on interpreting my opinion as a personal attack on your
product is really something else.  In fact, I hadn't brought any of these
points up; you're bringing them up yourself for brownie points.  You've
turned my message into a springboard for your (unsolicited) product ad.

>   In closing: you've all heard how wonderful v1.02 will be - it's been
>mentioned often enough. I am beginning to get the feeling that we ought to 
>release it even as it's being beta tested, as it will cure most, if not all, 
>of the complaints we've heard since v1.01 was released. I'd like to say that 
>registered users will get it first, but we're still working on the manual -
>it seems that a lot of things in the original manual were not understood (or
>not read at all).

Glad to hear it, although I might believe it more if you hadn't gone heavy-
handed on me.  You realize, of course, that after this I'm going to have to
hunt down a copy of Desterm just to see how it lives up to your claims...
--
The Moving Finger writes; and, having writ, | Ragnarok -- ragnarok@ziebmef.UUCP
Moves on:  not all thy Piety nor thy Wit    |----------------------------------
Shall lure it back to cancel half a Line,   | Path:  uunet!utgpu!(ontmoh!moore,
Nor all thy Tears wash out a Word of it.    |        ncrcan)!ziebmef!ragnarok