Path: utzoo!utgpu!watmath!watdragon!lotus!glroberts
From: glroberts@lotus.waterloo.edu (Gordon L. Roberts)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.ibm.pc
Subject: Re: MKS Toolkit questions
Keywords: MKS
Message-ID: <14198@watdragon.waterloo.edu>
Date: 31 May 89 05:26:31 GMT
References: <1283@esunix.UUCP>
Sender: daemon@watdragon.waterloo.edu
Reply-To: glroberts@lotus.waterloo.edu (Gordon L. Roberts)
Distribution: na
Organization: U. of Waterloo, Ontario
Lines: 69

In article <1283@esunix.UUCP> krogers@esunix.UUCP (Keith Rogers) writes:
>1) I believe that command.com is replaced by some other shell.  How big
>   is it?  (My concern here is of course the 640k memory restriction on
>   dos.)  Can it reside in epanded memory, which I don't have but am
>   considering getting?

Command.com can be replaced with the Korn Shell, but this is not
necessary.  All the utilities run fine without using the Korn Shell,
but if you want a better shell than command.com that also runs faster
then use sh.exe.  The Korn shell can replace command.com as the command
interpreter by sticking a line in your config.sys like
``shell=c:\bin\sh.exe''.  The shell takes up about 80K, but if you run
it with the option to load its transient code up high then that frees
up about 64K.  This is the same thing that command.com does.  Sh does
not use expanded memory, but then again neither does command.com.  I
think that it is a tricky thing to run programs in expanded memory.  I
have only ever seen it used as data space.

>2) Does something need to be done to run canned dos programs; i.e. does
>   command.com need to be reinstalled or something?  I guess I'm very
>   fuzzy on how MKS Toolkit relates to BIOS, etc.

DOS programs run fine because most of them don't need the command
interpreter for anything.  They just call DOS routines and if they
need a shell then they usually invoke the shell named in COMSPEC or if
they are really dumb then they will invoke command.com explicitly.
You can always run command.com if your program needs it.  Then again
you can just run sh.exe when you need it.  Both of them are just DOS
programs and you can run them at will and "exit" when you are done.
The only problem that I find is with the SWITCHAR.  DOS does not care
if \ or / is used as path separator, but / is normally the switch
character so you can't use use it for paths in this case.  You can make
a DOS call to change it to something else like `-' to be more UNIX-like
and then you can use / in paths, but some programs don't use the
switchar (they hard-code / in) so they can be annoying.  Up until DOS
3.3, command.com would use switchar so you could do something like
``command -c -e:512 c:/foo/bar/blech.bat''.  DOS 4.01 command.com seems
not to use the switch character anymore :-( arrgh.

>3) The bottom line is: will it run at an 'acceptable' speed on my AT&T
>   PC6300 (an 8086 based 8 Mhz XT like machine)?  I do have a hard disk
>   (who doesn't?) but it's not terribly fast.  I'm posting this article
>   so that I don't get a sales pitch to this question.  No doubt Mortice
>   Kern would tell me it's the greatest thing since sliced bread, even
>   on my lowly machine.

Sure, it'll run at an acceptable speed (i.e. it won't be any slower
that what you are using now).  It might even be faster.  Post away!
That's the way to get answers and MKS usually answers technical
questions, but they seem refrained about posting "advertising" except
writing that a product is available.  It's a UNIX environment on DOS
(the best of both worlds :-) so it is the greatest thing since sliced
bread :-)

>I am looking for any information from people who actually use or have
>tried the MKS Toolkit.  Post or e-mail as you see fit.  Thanks in
>advance,

I use VAX/UNIX 4.3BSD, SunOS and MS-DOS so if I can't make my UNIX
behave like MS-DOS (why would I want to anyway) then I might as well
make my MS-DOS behave like UNIX with a shell and utilities.  I use lots
of their stuff and I am very pleased with it.  I use vi, awk, and sh
the most.  Now if they would only include uucp, cnews, rn, mail,
cron... :-)  and add in a bit of multitasking and X windows... double :-)

Does it sound like I am a satisfied customer?  yep :-)
Do I sound tired?  Yep, good night.

glr/at