Path: utzoo!attcan!uunet!cs.utexas.edu!tut.cis.ohio-state.edu!ucbvax!UBVMSC.CC.BUFFALO.EDU!V133JR65
From: V133JR65@UBVMSC.CC.BUFFALO.EDU ("J.WIXSON")
Newsgroups: comp.sys.apple
Subject: Pirating again....
Message-ID: <8906012115.aa11470@SMOKE.BRL.MIL>
Date: 2 Jun 89 01:12:00 GMT
Sender: daemon@ucbvax.BERKELEY.EDU
Organization: The Internet
Lines: 22

Ok....since a few of you seem to be so interested in Apple pirating let me clear up a few rumors for you.  Before I start, let me tell you my background in
pirating on the Apple.  I got into pirating a few years ago when the most advanced modem for the Apple was the Apple Cat (103/202, 212)...remember those??  If 
you were into pirating back then you would remember all those Cat-fur bases and stuff like that....this was when 10 megs was considered TONS of space.  Anyway, I have run two pirating systems on the Apple //e....both were really pretty 
popular and I had callers from almost every state.  My second board was 2400,\
but my first was a CF when the Applecat was still popular.  Anyway, for the
most part the sysops do NOT MAKE money on these systems.  At the most a sysop
will break even with his original cost of a hard drive (lately pirated //e
programs have been up to 8 sides) because you need space plus the cost of a high speed modem and usually a Thunderclock and extended RAM.  This is usually made up thru a ONE time fee when a person becomes a member of your system.  I didn't
even come close to what I invested in my system, however it was worth it because I received tons of free programs (many before they were even released in stores), was able to talk free of charge to elite user/hackers all over the US and 
gained invaluable experience in programing and system design.

If you know anything about Apple pirating you will recognize the names Coast to Coast, Digital Gang etc...all group names.  These groups are made up of very
elite programers that spend their time cracking these programs.  No real pirate sells these, but they compete (between groups) to release a program first on a
bulletin board.  Each group usually has a board which sponsers and the program is first uploaded to this system and then other users quickly distribute it all \
around the US.  Now Apple games are way over priced and I wouldn't have paid for
any ONE of them in the last 3 years.  In fact, most elite Apple hackers and 
pirates have long switched to better comps, such as the GS, IBM or Amiga.
This is one of the reasons I no longer run my system as well as the fact that
I have better things to use my computer for.  For obvious reasons I'm not 
going to name individuals, but I knew many of the best crackers on the //e, not
one every made a dollar from it.  Most simply worked in software warehouses and had access to the programs free of charge.  Rumors that programs are stolen are
simply not true.  I hope I've shed some light on the subject to the few people \that seemed interested.