Path: utzoo!attcan!utgpu!utstat!jarvis.csri.toronto.edu!rutgers!att!mtuxo!lzfme!jwi
From: jwi@lzfme.att.com (Jim Winer @ AT&T, Middletown, NJ)
Newsgroups: comp.text.desktop
Subject: Re: Typography--Was Re: ventura
Summary: My error, my apology
Message-ID: <1393@lzfme.att.com>
Date: 8 Jun 89 14:50:34 GMT
References: <1368@lzfme.att.com> <4058@uhccux.uhcc.hawaii.edu>
Organization: AT&T, Lincroft NJ
Lines: 72

> > Jim Winer writes:
> >...
> >	4) If you're writing for a European audience, sans serif
> >           type is easier to read. In the US, serif is easier. (It
> >           depends on what you were brought up on.)
> >
> >... circuit designers ... they insisted that
> >their documents weren't *professional* unless they looked just like
> >the other documents they had seen. Isn't it interesting that high
> >tech professionals were more interested in conformity of appearance
> >than they were in communication of ideas? ...
> 
> Greg Lee comments:
> 
> The principle that what is most legible depends on what you're used
> to reading is known, but its application is apparently not understood.
> Perhaps excessive concern with the esthetics of design erodes the
> ability to make a cogent argument.

Jim Winer replies:

My apology. I forget that most engineers are used to 10 point Times
Roman created on a laser printer and then copied on the office
copier. The result is almost always broken letterforms (by the
second copy if not the first). Having spent all that time learning
to recognize broken letterforms, of course they now have difficulty
recognizing unbroken letterforms. By all means, give the engineers
the sh*t they are used to.

Greg Lee continues his comments:

> I am not schooled in book design, but I really don't see what special
> expertise is involved.  I designed and printed one book and helped with
> another, using TeX in both cases.  I just looked at some examples as
> models for the first version, then screwed around with the formatting
> parameters until it looked nice....

Jim Winer replies:

But were they good examples, or did you just duplicate more garbage?

Greg Lee continues his comments:

>                                ...Being impressed with the advice
> in the TeXbook that one should have the design done by a professional,
> I took my drafts to the publisher and got comments and advice, which,
> however, turned out to be quite trivial....

Jim Winer replies:

I wouldn't waste time with you either (this discussion is for the
net, not for you).

Greg Lee continues his comments:

> is even much of a craft, much less a science (as some seem to be
> contending).

Jim Winer replies:

Neither engineering nor book design is a science (leave that to
scientistss). Book design is not a craft -- engineering is a
craft. Book design is an art. 

Jim Winer ..!lzfme!jwi 

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