Path: utzoo!utgpu!jarvis.csri.toronto.edu!rutgers!apple!sun-barr!texsun!pollux!ti-csl!m2!holland From: holland@m2.csc.ti.com (Fred Hollander) Newsgroups: gnu.gcc Subject: Re: Free [Software] Foundation Message-ID: <80719@ti-csl.csc.ti.com> Date: 12 Jun 89 19:23:24 GMT References: <80065@ti-csl.csc.ti.com> <8906082153.AA06661@wheat-chex.ai.mit.edu> Sender: news@ti-csl.csc.ti.com Reply-To: holland@m2.UUCP (Fred Hollander) Distribution: gnu Organization: TI Computer Science Center, Dallas Lines: 81 In article <8906082153.AA06661@wheat-chex.ai.mit.edu> tower@AI.MIT.EDU (Leonard H. Tower Jr.) writes: > > From: sun-barr!texsun!pollux!ti-csl!m2!holland@rutgers.edu (Fred Hollander) > Organization: TI Computer Science Center, Dallas > > In article <8906040445.AA04908@hop.toad.com> gnu@toad.com writes: > >Apple is free to use, modify, and distribute GCC, and I see no > >evidence of FSF wishing to modify the GNU Public License to prevent > >them. FSF just wants Apple to have to do it all alone -- without help > >from the supposed friends of FSF -- because Apple is actively working > >in court to prevent the Foundation from doing what it is chartered to ^^^^^^^ Note the use of the word charter. I refer to this and even though Len asks me to reread this paragraph and does not object to gnu@toad using the word charter, he strongly objects to my use of the word and follows with insults. > >do. > > You must have missed all of Stallman's postings. He emphatically > prohibited Apple from posting any messages in this news group, even > though the postings were strictly in line with the charter of FSF. > >Huh, charter? I'm a Director of FSF and I've never seen the FSF >charter! You must be referring to some mystical charter you've >created in your head. From mis-understandings of what the GNU Project >has always been about. I don't follow how you conclude that it must be a *mystical* charter that I created in my head. You are quick to insult me and attempt to discredit my views. I will not follow suit, but, rather explain my position. My understanding of your charter (and I don't mean that in the literal sense of a written legal document, but, as a general goal and purpose) is that FSF is providing *all* people with free software that they may improve upon and likewise distribute freely. I've reached this conclusion from the manifesto and people in this group, including Stallman. If I have misunderstood something, I welcome you to correct me, but, let's leave mysticism, name-calling and general insults out of this discussion. > That is, David Berry, who works at Apple, announced that he ported gcc > to the Macintosh. This entire discussion is a result of Stallman > implicitly changing the GNU Public License so that any organization > that does not succumb to his political beliefs or does not meet with > his ideals is not free to participate with FSF. > >False. All rms asked was that info-gcc/gnu.gcc, a forum created and >maintained by FSF, not be used to help Apple. The forum exists to >further the purposes of the GNU Project, not Apple's. Apple can still >use GNU software under the terms of the GNU General Public License. Not false. The direct purpose of David Berry's posting was to inform people about gcc, thus furthering the purposes of the GNU project. Naturally, since the port is for an Apple platform, there is an indirect benefit to Apple. This is true for all ports and should not be considered a form of advertisement. >Why Apple? Re-read gnu@toad.com first paragraph above. > > >A lot of people think that FSF is there to provide them great software > >for free. This is not true. > > It is certainly clear now that this is not true. Why not put the political > requirements in the charter? > >Again what charter? The GNU Manifesto and GNU General Public License >are both clear about this. Both have been widely distributed. Copies >of both are available from gnu@prep.ai.mit.edu. Why don't you read them. I have just read them both. I must have missed the *Apple* clause that takes back the right of *some* people to participate in the GNU project by decree of RMS! >enjoy -len Fred Hollander Computer Science Center Texas Instruments, Inc. hollander@ti.com The above statements are my own and not representative of Texas Instruments.