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From: attila@bellcore.bellcore.com
Newsgroups: comp.lang.lisp
Subject: Lisp/X-Windows/C query *** SUMMARY OF REPLIES ***
Message-ID: <18633@bellcore.bellcore.com>
Date: 19 Dec 89 16:45:30 GMT
Sender: news@bellcore.bellcore.com
Reply-To: attila@FLASH.bellcore.com
Organization: Bellcore (Bell Communications Research)
Lines: 76

***************************************************************
* Greg Sandell, Institute for Learning Sciences, Evanston, IL *
* sandell@ferret.ils.nwu.edu                                  *
***************************************************************

[ here is the original posting. ]

   I would like to hear from anybody who is involved (or has been involved)
   in using X-Windows in a LISP environment.  The obvious problem is that
   there is a wealth of information on using X in a 'C' programming
   environment, but very little with regard to LISP.  We have clx running
   on Sun SPARCs in our shop, but this appears to be a preliminary, 
   experimental package under development.  
   

	[...]

Date: December 19, 1989

CLIM (Common Lisp Interface Manager) is under development by ILA
(International Lisp Associates), Lucid, Symbolics, and Xerox; it will
offer a hardware and software independent high level UIMS which can run
on top of any (of the supported) X-window implementations.  The target
operating and window systems are: Genera, Open Look, MS Windows,
Presentation Manager, and SUN's implementation of X. 

Given that the promoters (Symbolics and Lucid) have the majority of
the Lisp market there is a good chance of it becoming a standard. Beta
copies are shipped about now, and first release is projected beginning of
2Q90.  I have a 39 page preliminary CLIM Manual with a print date of
August 89.  My copy came from HIC@ALDERAAN.SCRC.Symbolics.COM --HIC is
Howard Cannon who developed Flavors.  The rest is a summary of Howard
Cannon's talk given at Bellcore in November of 1989.

CLIM Highlights (as per Cannon's talk):
Features:
-oo system build from CLOS primitives; CLOS functions defined to talk to
X-window and other window substrates directly.

-the developer will not work in pixel coordinates (not like KEE) but in
logical descriptions, ie. on third from top, one half over, etc.

-includes an inking model which defines x forms

-output recording and incremental redisplay

-some application support

-some constraint language

Presentations:
The objective or philosophy of CLIM is to make a portable analogue of
the Symbolics UIMS (Dynamic Windows, Presentations Types).  So, CLIM
will 
-maintain semantic connection between the object and the graphic
presentations

-provide high level interaction
	-smart mouse activity
	-context dependent behavior...

-allow multiple display types from the same object (a la Presentation
Types) with inheritance and all.

The rest of the talk included some code samples and future directions.
The most interesting plan is to provide a "chameleon" capability, viz.
define a "menu" in some environment, say Genera, which will pop up the
familiar Symbolics menu for the three button mouse, while, in another
environment, say, Mac it will build the many bar, and drop downs for the
one button mouse.  Same comments apply to scrollbars, close box/quit
icons, etc.

For more information catch someone at one of the vendor organizations,
or start with your Lisp salesperson.

Leslie A. Walko, attila@bellcore.com