Path: utzoo!utgpu!jarvis.csri.toronto.edu!clyde.concordia.ca!rutgers!aramis.rutgers.edu!athos.rutgers.edu!christian From: dtate@unix.cis.pitt.edu (David M Tate) Newsgroups: soc.religion.christian Subject: Re: Is There Biblical Justification For Capital Punishment? Message-ID: Date: 7 Feb 90 05:47:06 GMT Sender: hedrick@athos.rutgers.edu Organization: Univ. of Pittsburgh, Comp & Info Services Lines: 64 Approved: christian@aramis.rutgers.edu In article crturner@udenva.cair.du.edu (CYNTHIA TURNER ) writes: > >Of course the story is told to create a paradox. How can a society which is >perceived as civilized permit capital punishment? For some people it is >equally that America, of all countries perhaps the most vociferous proponent of >human rights throughout the world, could still engage itself in what is felt to >be the most barbaric and inhumane of all punishments. With our 200 years of The *most* barbaric? Where have you been? I can think of a dozen common historical (and contemporary) punishments, used by official government agents, that I would rather die than undergo. For that matter, it is not at all clear to me that I would prefer to be subjected to 10 or 15 years of close confine- ment, homosexual assault, psychological abuse, and prison food, rather than die once. Need we even discuss torture (which is of course what the writers of the Constitution were talking about when they said "cruel and unusual punishment")? Would you really rather be tortured at great length than be killed? And what about countries that execute the *families* of criminals? Is that not more barbaric than capital punishment? I think you need to keep some perspective here... >say that. Instead, he says he deserves the worst possible punishment short >of taking his life. > Ah, he should be raped? His fingernail extracted with red-hot pincers? I doubt that this is what he means. Bundy understands, even if many well-meaning Americans don't, that there are many fates worse than death. >The issue should be decided on other grounds. That's the beauty of this >country. Let the people decide. If the majority favor it, let it be and >don't moralize it is wrong. > Hmm. I could get into a long discussion here about the difference between moral law and human law, but I'd best summarize. The purpose of laws (in the legislative sense) is to preserve order, so that everyone may enjoy a better life than they would if there were no laws. That's it. Period. Whatever you may think of that, for better or worse, "right" and "wrong" don't enter into it. (Please note: I am not denying that right and wrong exist, or are of great importance. I'm just saying that the law doesn't care about them *directly*.) Now, to preserve order, it is necessary that the people be content enough with their laws that revolution is avoided. This means having laws which tend to coincide with native ideas of justice ("For the Gentiles, having not the Law, are yet a law unto themselves"--this was *praise*, although we have perverted the phrase "a law unto themselves" in common idiom). It does *not* mean imposing the inter-personal morality of people onto the Law, and it certainly does not mean that society can avoid making the hard choices. Oddly enough, the abortion issue and the capital punishment issue are really the same thing: both ask, "In a society of limited resources, whom do we kill that the others may live as humans?" Anti-abortion forces say "Don't kill fetuses; let the population of poverty-stricken children increase without bound until they start starving." Anti-execution forces say "Don't kill criminals; spend money and effort to keep them in large brutal hotels for years at a time, rather than spending that money to end poverty, hunger, or the drug traffic." I know that this sounds like a harsh assessment, but I hope you will think about it in a detached way. I find abortion and execution as distasteful, abhorrent, and unGodly as you do. I also recognize that the alternatives to them may be even worse. -- David M. Tate | "The logarithms of 1,2,...,10 to base 10^(1/40) dtate@unix.cis.pitt.edu | are conveniently close to whole numbers, which | when you think about it, is why there are 12 "A Man for all Seasonings" | semitones in an octave." -- I. J. Good.