Path: utzoo!utgpu!jarvis.csri.toronto.edu!cs.utexas.edu!swrinde!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!usc!apple!rutgers!aramis.rutgers.edu!athos.rutgers.edu!christian From: userPUB1@mts.ucs.UAlberta.CA (Scott Advani) Newsgroups: soc.religion.christian Subject: Re: demons and such Message-ID: Date: 9 Feb 90 07:28:35 GMT Sender: hedrick@athos.rutgers.edu Organization: University of Alberta (MTS) Lines: 79 Approved: christian@aramis.rutgers.edu In article , hwt@.bnr.ca (Henry Tro > >This is a question I've been meaning to ask in this group for a while - from >the other side. I don't believe in Satan, deveils, nor Hell. > >I'm originally Scottish Episcopalian, now Canadian Anglican (little difference) This is something that has interested me, too, since I trusted in Jesus Christ and became a Christian. The Bible does talk about Satan rather often (should Satan be capitalized - did that become his name after he fell? He was Lucifer before...). If you believe in the God of the Bible, then whether you like it or not, angels, Satan, and his demons are part and parcel of the whole package. These demons are a good explanation of many of these psychic "new age" things that people do and experience - out of body experiences, channeling, ouija boards, seances, etc. When you deal with this dangerous, and darker side to the Christian experience, you are not dealing with what you might think you are. Take seances, for example. When the medium makes "contact", if the Bible is true, he or she is not in contact with the person, but with a demon who knew that person (if the medium is not a fake). Ghosts and hauntings, by the way, are similar experiences, only the demon is manifesting itself in a different way. Now, why do I believe this? I'm glad to say I've never personally experienced a demonic presence with the clarity of one of the above examples, but the recently deceased Dr. Walter Martin had the experience of exorcising demons on a number of occasions. One of the possessions involved a ten-year-old boy who had been possessed by TEN demons when his CHRISTIAN mother took him to a seance! (of all the stupid...) He had been possessed during the seance at the age of eight, I believe. As a result, he began to frighten his mother and the neighbors in his neighborhood. He'd pronounce curses on people, and they would happen. When Dr. Martin prayed over the boy, he asked God that if there was anything bothering this boy, if it were His will, would He help the boy? When Dr. Martin (and others) laid hands on the boy, (who was sitting in a chair) the boy suddenly slithered from the chair onto the floor face down. When he rolled over, his face had contorted into something inhuman (according to his description). His tounge was flat on the bottom of his mouth, his mouth was open, and his lips didn't move, but a DEEP voice screamed, "Leave US alone! You puny human, we will DESTROY you!" The boy began to struggle, and Dr. Martin tried to hold him down. Now, think about this. If you've ever seen a picture of Dr. Martin, he was a big person - about 180 lbs. This 10 year old almost lifted him off the ground! It took all of Dr. Martin's strength to hold the boys arms on the ground. Three hours later, ten demons had been cast out, in the name of Jesus Christ. Dr. Martin, by the way, was not the only witness to this - there were three other people in the room besides the boy, his mother, and Dr. Martin. There are other experiences that Dr. Martin relates. The point is that demons are real. When you play with things like ouija boards, horoscopes, tarot cards, seances, channeling, crystal balls, crystals, etc. etc. etc. you are opening a door to the invisible world, and you have no control over what comes out. Thank God that Jesus Christ protects us from this, and delegates His authority to us. BTW, this doesn't mean that every case of something bad happening is the result of possession. It's usually the last on the list of things that could be wrong. But, don't get caught in the lie that Satan spreads, "I don't exist." A thief does much better work when you don't think he's there. In Christ, -= Scott Advani =- ----------------- "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God." - John 1:1