Path: utzoo!utgpu!jarvis.csri.toronto.edu!cs.utexas.edu!uwm.edu!uwvax!rang From: rang@cs.wisc.edu (Anton Rang) Newsgroups: comp.sys.apple Subject: Re: Can the II be THAT bad? Summary: The PC is dead...almost. Let the ][ go with it. :-( Message-ID: Date: 26 Feb 90 22:42:01 GMT References: <3243@dogie.macc.wisc.edu> Sender: news@spool.cs.wisc.edu Organization: UW-Madison CS department Lines: 68 In-reply-to: lipo@vms.macc.wisc.edu's message of 25 Feb 90 03:25:48 GMT In article <3243@dogie.macc.wisc.edu> lipo@vms.macc.wisc.edu (Patrick Lipo) writes: > [ ... ] for every Apple product that exists there are probably ten >IBM products. Commercial products, could well be. In terms of free software, though, the Apple still seems to be ahead--at least, looking through my user group catalogs etc. Of course, it's getting harder and harder to find some of that stuff, especially now that TechAlliance seems to be slowly phasing out all of their Apple ][ stuff. :-( >The support for the II is the only thing that will save it, and its >not going to just come back. It is necessary to create a machine >that will be noticed by the rest of the computing world, not just in >a sidebar. The computing world has really changed a lot since the Apple ][ was introduced. It wasn't originally intended to be a machine for the "computing world"; the computing world back then was huge mainframes, and university PDPs. It was intended as a machine for hobbyists, and (later) as something the average person could use. I think that the real problem is that computers are no longer seen in the same terms. When I picked up an Apple ][+, I had no idea what computer science was; I just thought that it was fun to play with, and that it could do some useful things (keep track of my magazine collection, things like that). Nowadays, computers have been reabsorbed into corporate society, and the PC--as a computer for the ordinary person--is pretty much gone. Maybe the Amiga will take over the Apple ]['s old spot; at least it's affordable. But judging from my personal experiences, there just aren't people around who are *interested* in computers as a hobby any more. And companies like IBM and even Apple aren't interested in selling computers to people any more...just check out their prices. >I just wish they would come up with a II (hopefully upgrade) that >does something that most other comparable machines don't. I don't >care what it is--speed, capability, cost--but it should be something >to cause others to take notice. Well, for a PC, you really don't *need* too much. Speed? OK, it's nice to play with a 25MHz 68030, and there are occasionally things which I suppose the speed would be handy for. But for the sorts of things that my mom or sister do, say--word processing, some music stuff, and cataloging--our Apple ][+ does just fine. I'd rather see a //e-class machine around $500, say with two 3.5-inch drives, than a fancier one at $1500. But I'm an idealist, and still think that computers could be used to help the average person's life. >NOTHING'S NEW, GUYS! The last new thing in computers was probably Visicalc.... (1/2 :-) I don't know. I've pretty much given up on the whole concept of personal computers by now. Maybe bulletin boards will revive them (FidoNet is a step in the right direction), but I'm not convinced. I think the world's missed a beautiful opportunity here. Oh well. Enough nostalgia for the day. Maybe I should start trying to convince myself to stay in computer science again.... :-) Anton +---------------------------+------------------+-------------+ | Anton Rang (grad student) | rang@cs.wisc.edu | UW--Madison | +---------------------------+------------------+-------------+